It's not about religion, but politics: 'Ram ke Naam' director Anand Patwardhan on Ram temple

Filmmaker Anand Patwardhan shares his thoughts on what happened during the Shri Ram Janmabhoomi-Babri masjid dispute and what lies ahead for India.

Ahead of the Ram mandir consecration in Ayodhya on January 22, Ram ke Naam filmmaker Anand Patwardhan shares his thoughts with DH on what happened during the Shri Ram Janmabhoomi-Babri masjid (RJB) dispute and what lies ahead for India as the 500-year wait of many Hindus for the Ram temple at the site, ends.  

Having extensively covered and documented the RJB, what are your thoughts on the Ram temple inauguration?

It is depressing and shocking that India has reached this stage. When I shot Ram ke Naam in 1990 in Ayodhya - that is now 34 years ago - the atmosphere was very different. The Hindutva propaganda was there of course, and karsevaks were trying to get to the site of Babri masjid. However, people in the villages and surrounding areas - Ayodhya, Faizabad - were clearly part of a syncretic culture. There was a lot of camaraderie. That has changed now, in what is being seen as a triumph of the Hindu majority.

In court, the evidence that was provided was cooked up. Both the Allahabad HC and SC judgement were shocking. In the Allahabad HC judgement Lord Ram was accepted as a litigant – as if he came down to earth to appoint a lawyer and was fighting for his property rights!

The SC ruled separately on the property matter and on the act of demolition.  They agreed that the demolition was an illegal act but pretended that it was done by “unknown anti socials” and proceeded to reward the act vandalism by giving property rights to the vandals. 

I asked karsevaks and revered priests who claimed to know the exact location of Ram’s birth if they knew when he was born. The answer was sometimes lakhs of years ago or crores of years ago or in the Treta Yug ‘before history was written’. They had no answer for when he was born but were sure he was born exactly where the Babri masjid stood - the logical fallacy of that continues to boggle the mind.

So what we have is nothing but ‘jiski laathi uski bhains’ [might is right] In a widely circulated VHP video made by Jain Studios, you see Ram Lalla or Baby Ram appearing miraculously inside the Babri Mosque in 1949. 

On the other hand, we were lucky enough to find and film Mahant Ramsevakdas Shastry, the priest who along with others had broken into the Babri masjid at midnight in 1949 to place Ram idols inside it. He was later arrested and bailed out and had documents proving this.

In December 6, 1992, when Babri was demolished, the idols disappeared. They were later replaced. Clearly there is no sanctity to any of this. 

The fervour which gripped and mobilised people at the time, as seen in Ram Ke Naam, do you think that fervour is possible in today's age or are the current generations too alienated to be mobilised?

The fervour was manufactured then, and the fervour now is also manufactured. At the time, with the Congress in power, Doordarshan put the long running Ramayana serial on primetime TV.  ‘Ram’ became a household name in India thanks to the TV serial since most of the population watched Doordarshan at the time. 

This was the second popularisation of Ram.

In the 16th century, around the same period when Babri masjid was built, Tulsidas was writing the Ramcharitmanas. Tulsidas visited Ayodhya at the time but Ramcharitmanas makes no reference to Babar having destroyed the Ram mandir marking the birthplace of Ram. 

Apart from this telling fact, in reality before Tulsidas, there were almost no Ram temples anywhere in India for the simple reason that the previously known Ramayana story was composed in Sanskrit by Valmiki and very few people could read or speak Sanskrit.

Tulsidas’ Ramayana increased the popularity of Lord Ram since it appeared in a language that the masses in North India could actually speak. If you look anywhere in the country before the 16th century there were very few Ram temples. You find Shiv temples and lots of other temples but very ancient Ram temples are rare. 

So, the Ram temples seen now are mostly post 16th century, post-Tulsidas giving a lie to the claim that there was a Ram temple where the Babri masjid stood.

Secondly, non-RSS archaeologists who inspected the place have said that the deepest digs in Ayodhya reveal Buddhist artefacts indicating that ancient Ayodhya may have been the Buddhist city of Saket. So before Ram there was Buddha and before Buddha there was probably a tree that Adivasis worshipped. One can go back in time, and there will always be different kinds of worship going on in different moments of history.

The Congress govt was in power when the Babri masjid came down. From dealing with the politics around Ram mandir then to turning down the invite now, what are your thoughts on how the Congress has party dealt with the issue?

The Congress fed into the narrative by commissioning the Ramayana serial on Doordarshan and later refusing to telecast films like Ram Ke Naam. It allowed the Babri locks to be opened for Hindus to pray and then for shilanyas to take place. There were compromises done throughout and every compromise was costly. 

Finally, I am happy that sense has prevailed and they did not compromise to the extent of going to the consecration ceremony on Jan 22 and legitimise the whole thing. 

Finally sense dawned that this is not about religion, it is all about politics. 

The mandir is coming up, so will the scar on the Indian psyche heal, or will the wounds continue to deepen? Why?

There is never any closure with a fascist-minded majoritarian organisation. Every concession you make leads to a larger demand. The SC has already opened the door to the larger demand. Earlier, SC had said Ram temple is an exception, and the law which stood as per the apex court’s past judgements that one can’t change a place of religious worship would stand in future matters. However, they have already reneged in Gyanvapi and Mathura. So, there is a long list of trouble spots that can be raked up to create the polarisation that BJP needs. 

After Ram Janmabhoomi, is the Sri Krishna Janmabhoomi next? What do you see for the future of Shahi Idgah?

The writing is on the wall. BJP is interested in a full-blooded Hindu majority country where everybody else will be second-class citizens. Whether it is through CAA or Ram mandir - it’s all the same process. A Hindu Pakistan is what they want - a religious state. May not be in name, but in content it’ll be that. They will likely keep the same Constitution since they don’t have the guts to rewrite it right now - that’ll happen at some point they feel they are strong enough, but even without rewriting the Constitution, they do just ignore it. 

The Ram movement - started by the Sangh parivar - mostly included upper caste people. Would you say the BJP broke the mould in its own way, through invitations to leaders from Dalit, OBC and tribal communities? 

It’s just a matter of the use of language. Their whole enterprise is to see how an upper caste body can rule the country by getting the working class and other classes to become a part of the project without them understanding what is happening. The upper castes in leadership can appoint a nominal president who as an adivasi will preside over the passing of anti-adivasi laws, like those granting Mr Adani all the rights to mine the minerals under the feet of the adivasis. People are brainwashed in this system to surrender what is naturally their own property to benefit the one per cent. 

The 1980s and 1990s saw sharp communal polarisation and yet you could make Ram Ke Naam. Do you think such an endeavour would succeed if attempted today given the social and political milieu we are in?

Forget about making Ram ke Naam, the question is will they allow me to show it? Right now, we are still in that space because the documentary was made a long time ago and has a Censor Certificate, so it’s legal to show it - how long that’ll last I don’t know. It’s a film they can’t digest but they have to put up with it until such time as they remove the certification. 

Among those going for Jan 22, how many objective or critical media people will even be allowed to shoot their own footage because now BJP does its own shoots and gives the feed to people? Will they allow independent cameras there? And yet critical voices will never be fully suppressed. History is a long story. Hopefully, the present chapter will be short.

POSTSCRIPT: On January 21, media outlets reported that the police had halted a screening of Ram ke Naam, and arrested three members of the movie club that had organised the event.